Josh Wagner 

I use the mentors and the individuals that I trust in my life to help me identify some deficiencies that may be in my blind spots. These are people that I trust, they have guided me through some very difficult times. And having somebody like that is very instrumental in developing a strong emotional intelligence that people my age and my background are very much lacking. And I have suffered from being not as emotionally intelligent as I am today. It's a constant development.

Paul Meunier 

Hello, I'm Paul Meunier, the executive director of the Youth Intervention Programs Association. And I'm a youth worker at heart. How lucky am I, I have the privilege to meet youth workers from around the globe and learn their stories and share them with the entire world. I'm glad you're listening because together we'll learn how their life experiences shape their youth work. As you listen, I encourage you to consider how your experiences shape what you have to offer young people. Welcome to this edition of The Passionate Youth Worker. Hi, everybody. If you love to hear stories about people who have overcome impossible odds, or if you love to cheer for an underdog like I do, then listen in because this is going to be a very satisfying 30-minute conversation. For this episode, we're joined by Josh Wagner from California here in the United States. He is a case manager for Children First Foster Family agency. Josh has a master's degree in social work and is giving back in a way that so many must have thought he would never be able to do. Josh, thanks for being a guest on the podcast.

Josh Wagner 

Thanks, Paul, for having me.

Paul Meunier 

Our early years, Josh, in life are so fundamental to who we are and what we do with our lives. In many ways, it's really difficult or almost maybe nearly impossible to undo what has been done to us so early on. I would like to start your episode off by talking about your early years. I know this is kind of a tough question to start your podcast off with but if you think back, if you will, what is your earliest memory that you have from your childhood?

Josh Wagner 

My earliest memory is actually a pretty sad memory. So, I was just over three years old. I remember sitting in a car hearing budump budump budump and I was going over the Bay Bridge in California, going over to San Francisco. And I was confused because this was a long car ride, I was young, something unusual for me. And I ended up going to an airport where I had to say my goodbyes to my older brother who ended up flying out to live with his father. At the time, I didn't know what was going on because I was just in foster care. And the only person that I knew and had any kind of connection left me on that day. So, that was my earliest memory.

Paul Meunier 

Wow. And you were just three years old and you were with your older brother. Where were your mom and dad at this time, Josh?

Josh Wagner 

At this time, my or both my parents were consumed by addiction, drugs and alcohol. I didn't really have a relationship with my father. At this time, I really didn't even know who my father was. And I do believe at this time my father did not know that that was his child.

Paul Meunier 

Do you have a connection with your dad now?

Josh Wagner 

Right now, I have a connection as in regards to I do communicate with him. I will go visit him once in a while. But through the years, I don't have that relationship that a father and son has so it's not as strong. It's more of a cordial Hey, you're my father, you know, you gave me life and thank you. I want to be part of your life and be any type of inspiration that I can for you.

Paul Meunier 

And how old were you, Josh, when you reconnected with your dad or did you have connections with him throughout your childhood or is this something that kind of emerged after you maybe got out of high school or something?

Josh Wagner 

So, as a young person, I was like a free spirit, allowed you know, when have parents that are addicts you're allowed to live your life free of structure. I did eventually find out who my father was. And I used to go see him. But it was only, you know, I would ride for miles to his house and visit him for a little while. And then, you know, not see him for another six months at a time. And then it was like around the age of 10 that he requested a paternity test to make sure that I was his child. I got offended by this. So, I kind of got disconnected. And then, when I went into foster care he was always asking for visitation, communication, and I denied it every time just out of spite and not understanding the full scope of what was going on. So, I didn't necessarily build like a positive relationship until I was an adult.

Paul Meunier 

Got it. Thank you for sharing that. So, then most of the time, you were with your mom, right? But your mom also had a pretty bad addiction. Can you talk about your early years with your mom and how you ended up in foster care a little bit? I know, it's a long, complicated story. But if you could summarize that a little bit.

Josh Wagner 

Yes. So, I was in care at the age of three. My mom went through rehab, and then we were returned during her discharge from rehabilitation. I lived with her, we, you know, she did still suffer from addiction and then eventually which led to multiple partners, a lot of unhealthy choices where I pretty much had to fend for myself. I ended up eventually about, you know, seven or eight running out and doing my own thing. I would come in contact with my mom a couple times a year, typically to sign up for school. And then eventually, I ended up getting expelled from all the schools and I couldn't find my mom to enroll me anywhere. So, I ran the streets. And one day, a cop caught me. And I'm not sure how he found where I was but he eventually caught me. And then I was placed into foster care. At the time, I had a younger sibling that also wasn't in school, and she was with me. And so we both went into care. Shortly after that the radar was put out. So, my younger sibling ended up in care with us too. But I pretty much used to fend for myself. I had like, a fort that I would live in. So, it was a very difficult time for me as a young person.

Paul Meunier 

I can't imagine, Josh. Most of us at that age require so much structure and care from others to be able to survive and function. And here you were finding and meeting those needs mostly on your own. If you don't mind can ask you a couple of questions about your mom and some of those relationships she had? Did any of them ever become abusive. I can imagine there's a lot of emotional neglect and abuse, probably but is there anything else beyond that?

Josh Wagner 

So, my mother was, you know, she did suffer from alcoholism and heavier drug use. When she was sober, she was a great mother. But that was rare and far between. But when she was on a tangent, there was times I think that that's where I ended up one time she punched me in the face and that was like my final straw. That's when I started to fully disconnect from her. I didn't have the normal child-mother bond that most children have because I was ripped away at a young age and developed relationships with others. And then that was like my straw that broke the camel's back. That's when I kind of ran away and didn't really find a strong connection. So, I was, you know, capable of doing things on my own at that point.

Paul Meunier 

Unbelievable. To think about somebody that young, being out on their own, sleeping out on their own, finding friends, finding food on their own, often, as you and I have talked about. And then by the time you were eight, you started to get into some trouble or maybe you're even in trouble before then. Can you talk to us a little bit about how that all evolved?

Josh Wagner 

So, I was a young person. Typically, when you're living on the streets, you have to find people to protect you. You have to find ways to survive. So, I started to get involved with gangs within the community that I lived in. I started to steal a lot because I had to survive. I would break into people's homes, and I wouldn't steal their valuables, I would be stealing their food. And, you know, about eight years old was when I received my first felony as a young person. Luckily, it didn't result in anything serious. But I was hanging out with an older bunch of boys and we ended up stealing some tractors at a construction site there in our town. And we went joyriding all night and did some damages to some, you know, agriculture. We were young kids being young kids with big toys. And I'm glad that we actually because we seriously could have hurt ourselves. So, we kind of lucked out that nothing more severe happened.

Paul Meunier 

So, at this point you're around eight years old, somewhere around that. If you think back to that first eight years of your life, what kind of memories or what kind of thoughts or what kind of emotions do I attach to that, through those early years?

Josh Wagner 

I think I would have to say that being in the profession I have now I look back, and I feel sorry for myself. But then at the same time, I wouldn't change it because it built me up to who I am. But no child should have gone through what I went through. I don't think that it's appropriate to, you know, have that lifestyle at such a young age. And just having to, you know, I knew where all of the places that would throw out perishables that were still somewhat edible. I knew how to or which places had community gardens that I could break into and take veggies and eat. An eight-year-old and a little bit older, should not know those things at that age.

Paul Meunier 

This is what I find absolutely jaw-dropping about you is that you said you'd never you wouldn't change it, it's who you are. And that is so fundamental for us to understand how important our life experiences are to who we become as an adult. Despite those turbulent times in your life, and you describe it as no young person should have to do it, you don't want to undo it. You're content with who you are as a person and what you've become. That is incredible, Josh. So, if we skip ahead to like middle school years, I understand school was really tough. You couldn't read very good. But then you were in another foster home and you kind of have this love for Harry Potter. And that kind of was a transformational moment. Can you talk a little bit about your experience around Harry Potter and what that did and how that changed your trajectory?

Josh Wagner 

Yes. So, this was around the time they filmed the first Harry Potter movie. And I was a young kid at this time, I finally felt safe so I can act my age. A little bit of immaturity came into play and I wanted to watch the Harry Potter movie. And I ranted and raved about it. And my foster mom at the time said, No, I'm sorry, but I'm not going to allow you to watch that movie. And I pleaded with her. And she informed me that the reason behind her being so against me watching the movie is because a movie can never compare to a book, which for me at the time, I could not read. I was maybe at a second grade reading level, reading like five-page books. And this foster parent took the time and dedication. She went out that day, bought the book for me. And she worked with me on my reading. And she said, once you finish this book I will allow you to watch, we'll go to the movie theater to get that. So, I pursued it. I could not read every word in there. There were some names in there that were beyond my capability of sounding out or anything. So, I would make up words, you know. I would call Hagrid Haggy just because that's what I could do. But I made it through that book. And that was probably the most pivotal moment in my life that changed the trajectory of where I would go.

Paul Meunier 

Unbelievable. It goes to show the power of one person, one caring adult that went out of her way to do the difficult thing to better your world and better you as a person. And that's what youth workers do all the time. And this foster mother, I don't know if she knows your story now or has any history but man, she really made an impact in your life.

Josh Wagner 

Most definitely.

Paul Meunier 

Joshua, we have to take a short break. When we come back, I want to talk a little bit more about your development. So, we'll be right back.

Jade Schleif 

No matter how you support our young people, The Professional Youth Worker, powered by YIPA, has your training and learning needs covered. Visit training.yipa.org, that's training.yipa.org to see for yourself. And then join the 1000s of youth workers around the globe who learn from our easy to access exceptional trainings. From our blogs to our podcast, The Professional Youth Worker is your go-to resource for tools to help you keep going, keep learning, and keep growing. Members enjoy free unlimited access to Live Online and On-Demand trainings, and a preferred discount pricing for our one-of-a-kind certificate course. Annual memberships are ridiculously affordable for individuals and organizations. Visit training.yipa.org. today to learn more. That's training.yipa.org.

Paul Meunier 

Joshua, right before the break we talked a little bit about the foster mother who changed your world. And then you went on and really did good academically in high school. Can you just talk a little bit about how did you go from, you know, hardly being able to read to excelling in high school? You must just be kind of an inherently a pretty smart person.

Josh Wagner 

I would hope that I'm pretty smart. But I think I'd have to give credit to the people invested in me. But when I did go into high school at this point, I stopped being so rebellious. At this point, I realized that I was able to shower every day, I had a meal that I could eat every day. So, I stopped being so defiant. And then I decided to accept help. You know, that push with that book prior to high school was I think, the one thing that changed my whole world. Somebody invested in me so, I decided to accept others' help. So, once I got into high school, I started to get involved in extracurricular activities. And I became a spokesperson for my school. Some of the leaders of the school would ask me to go and advocate for our school because the individual that was voted in wasn't as vocal as I was. At this time, I was an extreme advocate for foster care. So, I was already participating in another nonprofit, fighting to pass laws for foster kids, as a high schooler.

Paul Meunier 

Wow. So, you went on you graduated from high school. At this point, you were kind of peaking in life, you're starting to realize there's things around you that can help you if you feel like they're safe enough to trust. And then you made another big change that probably was pretty instrumental. You joined the army. And that, was that right after high school?

Josh Wagner 

I spent a year right after high school attempting to go to school. I went through a traumatic scenario in my foster home. My foster mom died of cancer during my senior year of high school. It kind of rocked me a little bit. I was still a strong kid, but it was a little bit of a rocker. And then my foster father, I stayed with him because, you know, they cared for me and I wanted to care for him while he was in his most vulnerable state of his life. But then I had to go off to college and I left him and then during that time, we kind of severed our relationship. He was, you know, a dark time for him and I understand it so I didn't hold it against him. But I lost the structure.

Paul Meunier 

Yeah.

Josh Wagner 

So, I went in the military seeking that structure. And the military was very easy for me because I come from a life of foster care and living on the streets. So, it was a lifestyle that, you know, was kind of falling into what I already knew. But I did use it to build strong foundational, like, moral backings. I was able to establish myself as a leader.

Paul Meunier 

You were able to scan your environment find trusting people and to be able to use them to maybe supplement what you didn't have in the parental structure that a lot of young people have. And here you are today, giving back to other people maybe going through similar situations. You are and I know you still use trusted advisors and you still have mentors in your life that can play that role, including one of our former guests, Jack Witt. And what role do trusted advisors or mentors or, you know, friends that you might have, what role do they play in your life today?

Josh Wagner 

They play a very crucial role. I am a person that believes that we're in a state of constantly learning and growing. And the best way to grow is to have others pushing you and mentors that can help you identify deficiencies. So, I use the mentors and the individuals that I trust in my life to help me identify some biases I may have or some deficiencies that may be in my blind spots. These are people that I trust, and I trust their opinions. They've guided me through some very difficult times. And having somebody like that is very instrumental in developing a strong emotional intelligence that, you know, people my age and my background are very much lacking. And I have suffered from being not as emotionally intelligent as I am today, just in the years past. So, it's a constant development.

Paul Meunier 

You, to me are amazing. Your ability to navigate the world kind of on your own is something that's just inspiring to me. And I think our listeners would probably agree. So many of us didn't have to face what you had to face when you were young. And it's amazing somehow you rose all above that. That speaks to your character, Josh. That speaks to your grit, your determination, your perseverance, and also your ability to help other people. And I know when we get into this work of supporting young people we learn a lot about ourselves because young people teach us a lot. We don't have a choice but to pay attention because they will make us. What have you learned about yourself now that you're on the other side of this conversation with people? You were once talking to people like you, and now young people are talking to you. What have you learned about yourself in that process?

Josh Wagner 

Well, it's a complicated thing. Early on, I actually had, you know, impostor syndrome beyond belief. I could not believe that I was on the other side of the table. So, I suffered from anxiety. And it was a struggle. But through the process I've learned that, you know, all those people that were helping me throughout my life are people. They suffer the same thing. They may sit on the other side of the desk but their heart may be pounding just as hard as mine. So, I was able to really have humility and understand what that's like, which I think has helped me be a more passionate worker than I am. That I know what they're going through. And I've learned that there is some type of unseen, sometimes I feel like, they could connect with me so much faster. It's like they know my past without me disclosing, you know. Humans are so fascinating in their ability to have the I don't even know how to put it into words, that they're able to identify your past and connect, and trust. I'm able to build trust so fast with the individuals that I work with.

Paul Meunier 

I got to believe that is 100% accurate. Young people have the radar to determine who's trusting and who's not trusting. And I bet you had such a highly developed sense of that from your early years in life that you then can radiate that back to other young people. I'm wondering, what does it mean to you on a very personal level, Josh, to now be giving back and helping these young people that may not experience exactly the same kind of struggles you went through but similar types of struggles. What does it mean to you on a personal level to take pride gratitude, what kind of feelings do you have about being able to do that?

Josh Wagner 

I would say that it's the most rewarding thing that I could ever do as a career. There is a large sense of pride in what I do and how I do it. I am very proud to be a social worker, case manager, however you want to label it. I am extremely proud of what I do. And I wouldn't change it for the world. Oh, I'll take that back, I have changed it. I've tried to leave. You know, this is a difficult job working with these young people and the transference and countertransference, it occurs, it beats you down, and I've had to take some time, and I've left the field. But you know, when your heart is there, and you're good at what you do, you're drawn back. So, it's something that you know courses through my veins. This is who I am and I identify as a youth worker.

Paul Meunier 

Josh, how do you describe success in your work now with young people?

Josh Wagner 

Success for me is impacting one person. Now, every day, that's my goal, is to impact one person because that one person may develop that same goal as they grow. And I will never know if I impact somebody. And I don't want to know because I want to continue to have that goal of impacting one person. So, every day, I don't know who it is. So, I'm going to try to impact every person I come in contact with.

Paul Meunier 

Good for you. And by doing this podcast episode and revealing so much about yourself you undoubtedly are having an impact on more than one person today because a lot of people are gonna listen to this and be inspired by your story. I have one more question before we wrap things up. What's your favorite part about working with young people?

Josh Wagner 

My absolute favorite part about working with young people is what I call flicking on the lights.

Paul Meunier 

Flicking on the lights. Okay.

Josh Wagner 

Flicking on the lights. So, I work with foster youth. And sometimes I have to interact with them at their most vulnerable, their most horrific. They're basically transplanted into a whole nother world. They're removed from everything they know, every person they know, and they're place in a foreign land. When I discuss it with people I describe it as being you know, how would you feel about being transplanted into China? You know, you have to learn the culture, you have to learn the dynamics, all of the things that are involved with being in that new spot. So, I'm there for somebody who is completely lost. And they are, they're shut down. It's their world is dark. But after a little bit of time with the people that I brought into their life and myself, there's a drastic change. And you can see a light flicker in them.

Paul Meunier 

Nice.

Josh Wagner 

So, flipping on the lights.

Paul Meunier 

That's a great way to describe it. Very cool. Josh, I opened your episode by talking about cheering for the underdogs. I think that people who do youth work are like that inherently because we generally work with the young people that are struggling to find their way into the general society, the general infrastructure. And we get so much satisfaction when we watch young people succeed or move on or see the lights go on, flicker the lights on. And you are such a classic example of the power of youth work and the power of building relationships with young people because look at what happens when we do. I think about your foster mom and all the people that you've met along the way, including Jack Witt, by the way, what a phenomenal person to have as an adult, as a mentor. And so, I want to say thank you for choosing to put your skills and your intellect to work for helping other young people. And it has been just an absolute pleasure to meet you and learn your story. And it so reminds me of how important this work is. You are just the living, breathing example to me of why we do this stuff. So, thank you for all you do and all you will continue to do. And thank you for being a guest on the podcast.

Josh Wagner 

Thank you.

Paul Meunier 

Josh, before we go I always like to give the guest the last words to close out their episode. What words of wisdom or inspiration would you like to leave with the listeners?

Josh Wagner 

Well, I would like to tell everybody that the work that we do is one of the best things that we can do. And that my word of advice is that we, as youth workers, are like gardeners and the youth that we work with our community garden. So, as we do what we do, just remember that every interaction that we have is planting a seed in somebody else's garden. Sometimes you will sit there and you'll water it, you'll nurture it, and you'll be able to reap the rewards. But sometimes your called to move on from that garden. It doesn't mean that that seed will not grow. And somebody else may need to nourish that seed and help it develop. But the work that you're doing is planting seeds throughout many people's lives. Some of the greatest things, you know, the sycamore trees come from a small seed, those who plant them or have put them in place and never really get to see the beauty that they become. So, know that the work you're doing, that foster mom that planted the seed of reading, she doesn't get to see who I've become. I haven't had contact with her in 15 years, but I've become who I am today because that one little seed that she planted. So, continue planting seeds please.

Paul Meunier 

If you would like to share your passion for youth work, we'd love to spotlight you as a guest. If you have feedback about the show, please let us know. Just visit training.yipa.org, that's training.yipa.org and click on the podcast tab. This podcast is made possible in part due to a generous contribution from M Health Fairview. I'm your host, Paul Meunier. Thanks for listening to The Passionate Youth Worker.