Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

When I get that call from a parent who said, man, my kid is doing more of this now for after kinda kick it around with you. Or when I get a call from a kid saying, hey Dhop, I got accepted into Howard University. Thank you. Hey, man, the things that you guys helped me with. Man, I actually got that scholarship that we went after. Things like that is what's really cool for me. I'll never forget like little kids when they all say to me, oh man, after doing the literacy program, man I'll be reading to my little brother dude, ya know I'll be like, aw cool.

Paul Meunier 

Hello, I'm Paul, Meunier the executive director of the Youth Intervention Programs Association, and I'm a youth worker at heart. How lucky am I? I have the privilege to meet youth workers from around the globe and learn their stories and share them with the entire world. I'm glad you're listening because together we'll learn how their life experiences shape their youth work. As you listen, I encourage you to consider how your experiences shape what you have to offer young people. Welcome to this edition of The Passionate Youth Worker.

Paul Meunier 

Hi, everybody, for this episode, we're joined by Andrew Hopkins from Minnesota, here in the United States. He is the Bright Futures and Best Buy Teen Tech Center Director for the Plymouth Christian Youth Center. Andrew credits all the people that have poured effort into him, and he enjoys doing the same for others. Andrew, the people who know you best call you by your nickname. So is it okay, if I call you a Dhop through our conversation?

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

Absolutely. That's, that's fine.

Paul Meunier 

Cool. Well Dhop, thanks for being a guest on the show.

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

No, thank you guys, for having me. I totally appreciate the opportunity to get to share my story.

Paul Meunier 

You grew up in a large family in Detroit. What was it like to be one of 10 kids in a family.

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

I mean, for me, it was great. My older brothers were so deep off into sports. And so I kind of followed in their footsteps. I have one sister out of that family and she continues to run everybody even to this day. So it was really, really super cool actually growing up with so many siblings, it was actually really, really cool for me.

Paul Meunier 

What did you like most about it? Was it just all the relationships you had with all your, your brothers and your one sister? Or was it that it just taught you to kind of fend for yourself and speak up and be heard in the midst of all these kids?

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

A combination of all of that, you know, you definitely had to speak up. You definitely had to understand how to maneuver and different personalities and different ways. And it got me to understand that people are different, even though you're from the same space. So that was very interesting. You know, you had to quiet brother, you had the loud brother, you had to do bookworm brother, you had that I'm in the streets brothers, we had the this, the that. So it was like a whole sort of village within itself. Right. So it was actually really super cool. Yeah.

Paul Meunier 

Cool. So which brother were you? Were you the one in the gym all the time? Or how did your other siblings describe you as that brother?

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

Ah, I was the one that they would describe as kind of real level headed. I thought things through quite a bit. I was able to learn from other brothers mistakes and different things like that. So I got to take a little bit of in from all of the different angles, right? Everything from the good, the bad, the ugly. I used to get frustrated with teachers because we all went to the same elementary school and the same middle school or junior high as it was called back then. I don't know if I'm aging myself at all. But in high schools, and I used to hate when teachers would be like, well you're in like your brother so and so. Or you're like your brother this, or you're like your brother that, that I didn't really like that a lot because I felt I was my own person. Right. But being family that is a sort of connected is that we do have so yeah.

Paul Meunier 

Yeah. Your mom and dad are like superstars to raise that many kids. What were your mom and dad like?

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

For us, we were very fortunate. Unfortunately, a lot of African Americans families now they don't have both parents in the household full time. And we were lucky in a sense that we had that. My dad was a hard worker, worked at Chrysler, retired on a Chrysler like a lot of men in Detroit, the saying is, you either work for the plant, or you work for a company that make something for the plant, right. And so we were part of all of that. My mom, fortunately, was able to be a stay at home mom, which was really super cool for us, because it always gave us someone who we can come to with any issues and problems. I grew up in a neighborhood where anything that you did, it somehow get home before you got home. So those type of things like that. So I was really, really cool. You know, again, my mom, God bless her soul and my dad, they raised us to the best of their ability, they raised us to be strong, competent, and for us to be caring people. So it actually rubbed off on us. And here we are today.

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

I would say my mom carried that very well. You know, my mom was one of them people, whoever she could help in a neighborhood, whatever issues or community things that was going on, my mom always kind of stuck out and led in those different areas. She always was thinking about somebody else, you always was concerned about other families, other kids. So it wasn't just about her kids, whatever things she tried to engage herself and involve herself in. It was always kind of with this concept and thinking of how can it actually help everybody? Versus just a particular family or not? So I would say that come from my mom, for sure.

Paul Meunier 

Yeah. And was your dad more than disciplinarian then? Or did you not have like that division or rules? Because I'm wondering, 10 kids? I'm sure you tested the limits a little bit? Yeah, I got that. And you do come across as a really strong, confident, critical thinker, level headed, but also a very compassionate and caring person. And I got that right away when we were getting to know each other that came through loud and clear how you do have feelings and emotions and are in touch with those. Where did that side of you come from more from your mom or your dad? Who was the person that was the empathetic person in the duo?

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

Oh, yeah, absolutely. We're traditional in a sense of like, the mom dealt with all that. There was always the threat of I'm going to tell your dad. But the actual discipline was handed down by my mom. We got whoopings and things like that. I know, nowadays, people think of that as oh, that's abusive. And I actually grew up with the concept that sometime discipline was needed. I think that's what definitely kept us on the right track. Nowadays, kids are kind of left to their own devices. You can't spank them, or I'm not saying child abuse. Don't get it twisted, or what I'm saying. Discipline has been taken out of the family structure. And I think that that is a problem. I think that some of the reasons why a lot of our kids are way off track of where they should be.

Paul Meunier 

Yeah, young people need parameters, right? Whether it's discipline, removal of privileges, or whatever, young people need bumpers in their world to know when they're kind of going off track and not going down the right lane anymore. And that's how your parents chose to do that. And for you and for your family, it seemed to work out pretty well, you stayed out of trouble for the most part, right?

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

Oh, yeah, for the most part, I grew up in an urban environment, Detroit, a lot of different things coming at you fast and furious. Fortunately, for me, I was able to kind of stay off of those things. I definitely didn't end up in prison time or anything like that. Fortunately, for me, a couple of incidents in my life early clearly deterred me away from that some things my brother's went through, made a couple of bad decision with some friends. And I kind of was like, yeah, I don't know about that? That ain't gonna be the kind of life that I want to live. So, you know, so I was relatively lucky in that. And again, like I say, getting disciplined when you did do wrong, kind of helped ingrain that concept of you don't want to go down these roads, you know, you want to kind of stay a little bit over here to the right. So.

Paul Meunier 

Yeah, I hear you, and I know when we were getting to know each other, you talked about critical thinking as something you do to try to help young people but you also talked about you as being a critical thinker. And that helped you in so many of those situations where the opportunity was there, but you made the right decisions for a whole variety of reasons. So how do you think that you being a critical thinker has helped you in the world so far? What has it done for you?

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

Well, what has done for me is it allowed me to take information and it allowed me to sit back, make decisions based on how that's gonna impact me and or others for that matter. I definitely deal from a space of, you just say, aint talking me into no BS, right? That just ain't gonna happen. I will research stuff, I will look up meaning, I will look at how that lands in my particular life and how that might affect others. I mean, I have buddies who would come up with all of these get rich quick schemes, or, Hey, man, let's go and slang this, or let's go and do that. And I would sit back and I think for a minute, and I'll be like, Okay, so we're gonna go do something at a store that we go at every day, where everybody knows us, and they know our voices and in our names, but we're gonna go and do this. Ah, I don't think so. That's not gonna end well. And what reinforced that critical thinking concepts for me was, I have friends who did go and do those things, and altered their lives, in and out of jail and different things like that. So it was reinforced to me that my process was the right thing to be doing. So that really helped me.

Paul Meunier 

Well I give you a lot of credit for that, you know, you've said a number of times, like, I'm grateful, I'm lucky, you use those kinds of terms. But in fact, I believe that you are pretty much responsible for a lot of those decisions you made. And you've been able to stay away from that the peer pressure is so great for adolescents to engage in that kind of stuff, especially young black people in urban areas. The pressure is just so enormous, to go down that road and do that kind of stuff. How did you hang out with people and be friends with them and still say, yeah, I'm not going to do that? What about you was able to navigate all that? How did you do that?

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

When you grew up in these different communities, there's all sorts of people right. When we were talking about learning at home, how to deal with different personalities, how to understand that all of that stuff just transpired, it rolled over into my real life outside of my house. I knew every gangbanger I knew every dope dealer. I knew every jackboy, I knew it, everyone to know. But also knew the basketball players, also knew the straight A students, also knew the creative people. I was able to interact inside of all of these circles. Guys who were on the far end of the spectrum, they respected the fact that hey, dude is cool, but he just aint on what we on. And so I was always able to kind of interact and engage with that. Plus, my go to always was, don't make me call my brothers. You know, everybody knew my family. And so it was like, nah, we ain't even trying to do him like that. He got a squad of his own that he could bring, so.

Paul Meunier 

Nine of them, right? Eight, I guess.

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

Yeah, eight, nine. And then I, also my dad, all of his brothers, all of them came up from Mississippi, during the Great Migration. All of them had 13, 14, 15 kids. So the Hopkins name, we were known all over the city, just because there was so many of us on top of it. So yeah.

Paul Meunier 

I didn't ask you this as beginning, but are you the youngest of all those boys?

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

No. So the way that all rolled out, we have my younger brother, who's the baby boy who's the baby of it all. And then my sister, then me, and then on up the ladder.

Paul Meunier 

We're talking all those dynamics just within your household, all the things that you had to learn to navigate and find your unique self within all those roles. It seemed like that spilled out into the streets, you're able to take those skills and use what you learn from all your different siblings and incorporate them into survival and also the thrive. Here you are the director of these programs. I read your resume, you've done a lot of really great things and you came out of that whole environment just thriving, and it's really cool that you've decided to take those skills and give it back to other people.

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

That is what was pouring into me is me doing the work that I'm doing is real natural for me. So authentic is what I want to do. It wasn't like I was forced into it. And like I say, just the things that people poured into me, I was just, you know, it was just a natural thing. This is what you're supposed to be doing. I've had other type of jobs and different types of pursuits in my life and different things like that. But it always did come back to how can I be of service to others. And it's not what I'm doing is making a difference is really the concepts of young people investing in their own successes. That's something that I talked to folks all the time, too many times programs think that they're the reason that somebody is doing something. And in my case, that's not the case. We just created an environment and a space for people to be able to find themselves and for people to get the answers to invest in themselves. That's what it's really about for me.

Paul Meunier 

I agree. And I'm so glad that you have decided to pursue this profession. Because I bet you, you are building true authentic relationships with young people that need somebody like you in their world to help guide them and to develop those critical thinking skills that you so masterfully have understood. We do need to take a short break. But when we come back, I'd like to talk to you a little bit more about some of the things you've learned in your youth work and some of the things that inspire you. So we'll be right back after this short break.

Jade Schleif 

No matter how you support our young people, The Professional Youth Worker powered by YIPA has your training and learning needs covered. Visit training.yipa.org, that's training.Y-I-P-A.org to see for yourself. And then join the 1000s of youth workers around the globe who learn from our easy to access exceptional trainings. From our blogs to our podcast, The Professional Youth Worker is your go to resource for tools to help you keep going, keep learning, and keep growing. Members enjoy free unlimited access to live online and on-demand trainings, and a preferred discount pricing for one of a kind certificate course. Annual memberships are ridiculously affordable for individuals and organizations. Visit training.yipa.org. today to learn more. That's training.Y-I-P-A.org.org.

Paul Meunier 

And we're back with Dhop who works that the Plymouth Christian Youth Center. Dhop, thanks for all your background that you provided us before the break about your family and all those dynamics and how you navigated some touchy situations? But let's talk about youth work.

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

Okay.

Paul Meunier 

What have you learned from being in a youth work field? What have you learned about yourself?

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

For me, again, it's a real natural space. For me, it's not like a forced space. Like I'm trying to interject myself into something. The things poured into me, I just attempt to do that. You've heard me use the term authentic, young people can smell out BS very quickly, right. And a lot of times the reason our kids don't engage and don't necessarily take advantage of some things that is placed in front of them, because it's not coming from a true authentic space. Somebody is interested because we need numbers for youth, we need to show where we came into the community and tried this or we need to do that. I tend to try to be as authentic as I can with young people, they seem to gravitate toward that. In being authentic, it allows me to meet young people where they're at versus me thinking, well, you should be here or you should be there or anything like that. A lot of my engagement, again, is from a concept of coaching versus teaching. You may have heard me say earlier, things I didn't like about my teachers, because I kind of felt they were always trying to put their perspective on you. Whereas coaching is this different concept of, okay, let's figure out what your strengths are? And how do we really explore that, right? If you're a point guard, how do we get you to skills to really be the best at that? If you to shooter,  how do we give you the skills and the techniques to be better at that? Whereas teachers tend to try to...here's what I think and here's the answer. And that's what it is. So a lot of my engagement definitely rolls around coaching philosophies versus a teaching philosophy.

Paul Meunier 

I can see that and that authentic self. I think about all the young people today who are growing up with these systems that are designed to oppress, systems that are set up for young people to fail. And here you are. Dhop in the middle of all this. And young people see you talking like you talk terms of finding your strengths, pursuing what you're good at, using some rational thought to make some decisions that, how's that going to impact you? Do you find young people just gravitate towards you? It's hard to be humble. But you must just be something that these young kids just look at and go, God man, Dhop, man he just gets it?

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

Well, fortunately, they do. And I'm truly humbled by that, actually, because there's so much for kids to access now. Through technology, through their cell phone, through a computer, through a million and ome channels on television. Now, I mean, there's so many different things. And so again, where I try to land that with them is I've been there, done that. But I also can learn from you I actually learned more from young people than probably I actually get them. Being connected to them. I'm constantly learning new things. I'm constantly learning new ways that they think, and then I'm always trying to figure out how do I connect that to the things, and values that I share. And so it seems to be a pretty good combination of that. The young people I have been engaging with, we've seen kids whose went on to college, whose graduated, who has degrees now, kids who have went on, and I've opened up businesses and kids who are doing similar work to what I'm doing now. So just over the years, is this constant thing of seeing these young people evolve, and is always really good to see that they did take in some of the things that you said. Clearly there are some kids who didn't. And, you know, there might be some struggles and different things that they're going through. But overall, kids do tend to gravitate toward what I'm talking about, and what I'm kind of presenting and putting out there for them. Opportunities for them to engage in. And then when you mentioned racism, it's you know, I talked to young people about systematic racism quite a bit, getting them to understand that it's an entire system that is set up, from banking, so banks won't lend you money to buy a house. So you can't live in this community, which then means that you pay more money for gas in this community, therefore, you can't do that. How all of these things are connected to each other, that's why it's called systematic racism versus individualized or specific racism. And so getting them to understand why is so many roadblocks that they will run up against. And that's part of the battle with young people, if they don't really understand all of the different obstacles and the different things that's involved, they might focus on one thing, and then they'll never get to where they're trying to get to.

Paul Meunier 

I'm so grateful that you're in their world and in their space to help them navigate. Clearly those systems need to be broken down and destroyed and dismantled and rebuilt with an equity lens, without question. But I'm glad you're there for them now and helping them. You said something before that was so cool. When you talk about you learn more from them than you'll be able to teach them. How do you be so humble? Or, you know, vulnerable to say stuff like that? Because I think there's a human tendency for especially adults to want to be, I've got the answers here. I'm going to tell you what you should do. But you don't come at it with that approach at all. Where does that sense of humility and inquiry come from?

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

Well, for me, I think engaging with young people kind of like have, like different models, you know, I tend to function for more of an empowerment model versus a model of, here's where I know what's best for you. Here's where I'm going to take you into this. Here's where I'm going to show you how to get this job or how to do that. The problem with that sort of a model is when that person goes away, those people didn't learn anything. Therefore, now they're back to where they were at. All of those kinds of social services type models. That's why in my humble opinion, why they're not as effective is because once you remove that person, or that system that was doing everything for somebody, and then a lot of times, the collapse is even more worse, right? Because you didn't learn anything. And your sort of reverting back to what you were doing. Whereas when I talk about investing in your own success to where you are taking the lead on that you're taking that all I'm doing to sort of, hey, here's some resources, here's some things you may want to think about as you're trying to pursue this. But the onyx is put on you to be able to get yourself to where you want to get to. So when I'm out of the picture, you have those tools, you have those things, because you're the one that was doing it and was facilitating it all along. All we're doing is being a conduit, and creating a space in an environment. So I think it's important that young people realistically understand that, you have to want to do this. I tell people, I can't want it more than you want it. You have to want it more than me. That's sort of how I kind of think about empowerment concepts.  Dealing in things not from a deficit. Too many times our kids are engaging with people and programs and spaces, where they come in, and they're already looking at you as a deficit. And so if I'm looking at you as a deficit, my expectation is gonna be lower for you. Because I already feel you can't do nothing, right. So I don't go into it like that. I go into it thinking that young people are powerful, they're strong. They just need a little swerve in a direction that's all.

Paul Meunier 

Beautifully said. What do you like most about being a youth worker, Dhop? What do you get out of it?

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

For me, truthfully, what I get out of this, when I get that call from a parent who said, man, my kid is doing more of this now for after kind of kick it around with you. Or when I get a call from a kid saying, hey Dhop, I got accepted into Howard University. Thank you. Hey, man, the things that you guys helped me with. Man, I actually got that scholarship that we went after. Things like that is what's really cool for me. I'll never forget like little kids when they all say to me, oh man, after doing the literacy program, man I'll be reading to my little brother dude, ya know I'll be like, aw cool, you know? So, I mean, it's great when you get funding and stuff like that, because that sort of lends itself to saying that you're doing something that's cool or good or whatever. But I'm more of an anecdotal person and more like direct contact. So it's things like that, that make me keep saying, oh, cool, we're good. You know, we go keep plugging, we go, keep plugging. That's what I really like when young people say things, or I hear from their parent. Or if I hear from a family member, man, dude, attitude is different. Now, you know, he ain't even hanging with that no more, or he's doing this now. That lets me know. And that's what keep me motivated.

Paul Meunier 

Thank you for choosing to pour your heart and soul into this work and doing whatever you can to help young people find their way in this world. Every young person has a gift to give back to our community.

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

Absolutely.

Paul Meunier  

It's a matter of just figuring it out, what that is, and helping them pursue that, and supporting them in their desire to achieve what it is that they would like to achieve in life. So I'm so grateful for your work. Thank you for doing that.

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

No, no, it's actually I'm more appreciative of being given the opportunity to do this type of work to be frank and honest. Again, like I say, it's a natural space for me. Probably very few people in the world, and in life get to actually do something they enjoy every day. So I'm really grateful for that opportunity.

Paul Meunier 

I share that with you do that. And I know other people who are really good at this, have that exact same feeling. Thank you for pointing that out. Our regular listeners know at the end of the show, I always ask guests what words of wisdom or inspiration they would like to leave with our listeners. So do you have what would you like to share with our listeners, as we close out your show?

Andrew Dhop Hopkins 

Try to connect with young people in a more authentic way. try to, you know, realistically meet them where they're at. Create expectations where young people don't just keep giving them all this low hanging fruit. Again, you have to invest in your own success. A program isn't some magic bullet. A program is not going to have every answer for you. So you have to really invest in yourself. There's a lot of resources out there. Just try to realistically connect with folks who's trying to do things. Stay positive in spite of some of the massive negativity that's going on around us try to find your authentic space.

Paul Meunier 

If you would like to share your passion for youth work, we'd love to spotlight you as a guest. If you have feedback about the show, please let us know. Just visit training.yipa.org, that's training.Y-I-P-A.org and click on the podcast tab. This podcast is made possible in part due to a generous contribution from M Health Fairview. I'm your host Paul Meunier. Thanks for listening to The Passionate Youth Worker.